Discussion:
Where are relays and switches
(too old to reply)
guido@hamanuals.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-19 21:41:55 UTC
Permalink
Hi, I'm a newbi to the list, but not CAD programs, etc. I used an older version of KiCAD and have drawings showing relays and switches on them, but after upgrading to the latest version I can't seem to find them.


Tutorials I've seen show them under Devices, but I can't find them there or anywhere else.


What am I doing wrong?


Thanks,


Bill
Dave Instone nospamfordave@aol.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-20 10:05:03 UTC
Permalink
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<p>


<p>Now that's interesting.  I have switches on my schematics, but a
couple of days ago I upgraded to ver 4.0.5 from 4.0.4 and having
seen this email I checked them, now they're only in my local
cache.  <br>
</p>
<p>Seems like 4.0.5 has dropped them into a black hole. even search
for sw or switch doesn't find them only a rotary encoder switch.</p>
<p>Dave<br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 19/02/2017 22:41,
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:***@hamanuals.com">***@hamanuals.com</a> [kicad-users] wrote:<br>
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<blockquote cite="mid:o8d3f3+***@YahooGroups.com" type="cite"> <span> </span>

<div id="ygrp-text">
<p><span>Hi, I'm a newbi to the list, but not CAD programs,
etc.  I used an older version of KiCAD and have drawings
showing relays and switches on them, but after upgrading
to the latest version I can't seem to find them.</span></p>
<p><span><br>
</span></p>
<p><span>Tutorials I've seen show them under Devices, but I
can't find them there or anywhere else.</span></p>
<p><span><br>
</span></p>
<p><span>What am I doing wrong?</span></p>
<p><span><br>
</span></p>
<p><span>Thanks,</span></p>
<p><span><br>
</span></p>
<p><span>Bill</span></p>
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Andy Eskelson andyyahoo@g0poy.co.uk [kicad-users]
2017-02-20 14:34:41 UTC
Permalink
This is exactly what happens when you don't create and use your own
libs.

You should never rely on the standard libs as provided because they can
change, in both content and location.

Another thing to check, is that the libs are in the component library
files list

preferences > component libraries

The default libs are usually in usr/share/kicad/library (in linux)
or in "wherever you install kicad" /library in windows.
select add, open the lib folder, select the lot and add.

Better still copy them to your own directory and add from there, then
future updates will have less of a chance to mess things up.

Andy




On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 11:05:03 +0100
Now that's interesting.  I have switches on my schematics, but a couple of days ago I upgraded to ver 4.0.5 from 4.0.4 and having seen this email I checked them, now they're only in my local cache. 
Seems like 4.0.5 has dropped them into a black hole. even search for sw or switch doesn't find them only a rotary encoder switch.
Dave
 
Hi, I'm a newbi to the list, but not CAD programs, etc.  I used an older version of KiCAD and have drawings showing relays and switches on them, but after upgrading to the latest version I can't seem to find them.
Tutorials I've seen show them under Devices, but I can't find them there or anywhere else.
What am I doing wrong?
Thanks,
Bill
_
John Robertson jrr@flippers.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-20 17:55:40 UTC
Permalink
Someone with time on their hands could go through the various libraries
attached to the different versions and merge them into a separate
libraries section on GitHub (or wherever).

Unfortunately I don't have the time to do anything like that - I just
like volunteering folks (ducking).

John :-#)#
(lurking mostly)
Post by Andy Eskelson ***@g0poy.co.uk [kicad-users]
This is exactly what happens when you don't create and use your own
libs.
You should never rely on the standard libs as provided because they can
change, in both content and location.
Another thing to check, is that the libs are in the component library
files list
preferences > component libraries
The default libs are usually in usr/share/kicad/library (in linux)
or in "wherever you install kicad" /library in windows.
select add, open the lib folder, select the lot and add.
Better still copy them to your own directory and add from there, then
future updates will have less of a chance to mess things up.
Andy
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 11:05:03 +0100
Now that's interesting. I have switches on my schematics, but a
couple of days ago I upgraded to ver 4.0.5 from 4.0.4 and having seen
this email I checked them, now they're only in my local cache.
Seems like 4.0.5 has dropped them into a black hole. even search for
sw or switch doesn't find them only a rotary encoder switch.
Dave
Hi, I'm a newbi to the list, but not CAD programs, etc. I used an
older version of KiCAD and have drawings showing relays and switches
on them, but after upgrading to the latest version I can't seem to
find them.
Tutorials I've seen show them under Devices, but I can't find them
there or anywhere else.
What am I doing wrong?
Thanks,
Bill
_
Andy Eskelson andyyahoo@g0poy.co.uk [kicad-users]
2017-02-20 19:26:05 UTC
Permalink
You don't really want to merge all sorts of libs, as that will just
compound the problem of not knowing what changes have happened.

You need to grab the libs and mods from somewhere you know that you used

Just keep it simple.

the very old libs and mods are all in the same place in the archive

kicad/share/library
kicad/share/modules

this is from the old version:
kicad-2013-03-31-BZR4008-stable-UBUNTU_12.04_full_with_components_doc.tgz

which I keep around.

Most file managers/archive managers will allow you to browse the archive
and just copy out the libs and modules to elsewhere. I have a directory
called old-kicad-libs with these for easy access just in case.

The libs components should be much the same, most likely problem is not having
them in the library list

The modules are now in the .pretty format, so there are more changes.

Converting from the old module format to the new .pretty format is easy,
but not always necessary it depends on what you have done in terms of
changes, names etc.

What I do is use my own lib directory, and when I need something new I
find or make the lib or module, and then just copy it into my own.

Andy




On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 09:55:40 -0800
Post by John Robertson ***@flippers.com [kicad-users]
Someone with time on their hands could go through the various libraries
attached to the different versions and merge them into a separate
libraries section on GitHub (or wherever).
Unfortunately I don't have the time to do anything like that - I just
like volunteering folks (ducking).
John :-#)#
bobcousins42@googlemail.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-20 22:01:35 UTC
Permalink
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.

KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable" library branch, so what you get is port luck.

However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code release, so you can get them here https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases

I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
Doug McKnight douglasmcknight@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-21 15:51:23 UTC
Permalink
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can things get changed without my knowledge?3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I can add to as required. How is it best to do that?4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog? 
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
CheersDoug


From: "***@googlemail.com [kicad-users]" <kicad-***@yahoogroups.com>
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches

  Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.


KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable" library branch, so what you get is port luck.


However, library snapshots  are tagged in github with KiCad code release, so you can get them here https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases


I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS. #yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645 -- #yiv0242137645ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-mkp #yiv0242137645hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-mkp #yiv0242137645ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-mkp .yiv0242137645ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-mkp .yiv0242137645ad p {margin:0;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-mkp .yiv0242137645ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-sponsor #yiv0242137645ygrp-lc {font-family:Arial;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-sponsor #yiv0242137645ygrp-lc #yiv0242137645hd {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;}#yiv0242137645 #yiv0242137645ygrp-sponsor #yiv0242137645ygrp-lc .yiv0242137645ad 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Bill Turini guido@hamanuals.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-21 17:44:56 UTC
Permalink
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.

From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.

I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.

Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.

Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
Donald H Locker dhlocker@comcast.net [kicad-users]
2017-02-21 18:52:25 UTC
Permalink
That's pretty funny. "Stable" is only what you have locally vetted and saved with the project.

In a former place, not too long ago, a contract engineer overseas designed a [fairly large] board for us using the Cadence "standard libraries". When taped out (to Gerbers) on this side of the Atlantic, all of the pads on all footprints and soldermasks were notably undersized. Gerbers from them were right-sized.

Let me repeat, "stable" is only what you have locally vetted and saved with the project.

Donald.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 12:44:56 PM
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
'info@drukknop.nl' info@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
2017-02-21 19:08:53 UTC
Permalink
Hmm. strange.

I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.

I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.

I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.

The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.

Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.

I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.

I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.

just my 2 cents
Post by Bill Turini ***@hamanuals.com [kicad-users]
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'John Woodgate' jmw1937@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-21 19:42:33 UTC
Permalink
Is this:

I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.


about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I have asked many times how to do this, with no response.

With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England

Sylvae in aeternum manent.

From: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com [mailto:kicad-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches


Hmm. strange.

I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.

I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.

I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.

The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.

Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.

I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.

I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.

just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'info@drukknop.nl' info@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 09:10:55 UTC
Permalink
it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv format.

The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.

Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'John Woodgate' jmw1937@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 09:24:54 UTC
Permalink
Thanks. How does one get 'Boms-away'?

With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England

Sylvae in aeternum manent.

From: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com [mailto:kicad-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:11 AM
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches


it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv format.

The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.

Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'info@drukknop.nl' info@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 10:55:28 UTC
Permalink
googleing is difficult without verbatim mode (the default unfortunately)
but look here:

https://github.com/Jeff-Ciesielski/Boms-Away
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thanks. How does one get 'Boms-away'?
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:11 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv format.
The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.
Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'John Woodgate' jmw1937@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 11:34:10 UTC
Permalink
Thank you, but I am a Windows users and I don't 'do' Python etc.

With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England

Sylvae in aeternum manent.

From: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com [mailto:kicad-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 10:55 AM
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches


googleing is difficult without verbatim mode (the default unfortunately)
but look here:

https://github.com/Jeff-Ciesielski/Boms-Away
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thanks. How does one get 'Boms-away'?
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:11 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv format.
The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.
Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'info@drukknop.nl' info@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 20:26:37 UTC
Permalink
I'm not familiar with windows, so I can not help you there. sorry.

python is fun and very easy to work with. I use it a lot to emulate
serial interface machines I am designing machines for that are not at my
shop.
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thank you, but I am a Windows users and I don't 'do' Python etc.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 10:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
googleing is difficult without verbatim mode (the default unfortunately)
https://github.com/Jeff-Ciesielski/Boms-Away
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thanks. How does one get 'Boms-away'?
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:11 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv format.
The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.
Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
Jorge Ferreira jorgef.tech@gferreira.eu [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 21:02:36 UTC
Permalink
Hi

Only because you don't want.

Python is available for windows and is widely used as a scripting
language in a number of applications that are distributed with SDKs for
python.
For example, the last GIS (geographical information system) I used was
equipped with an full blown SDKs for both Python and VBA, but spatial
transformations were available only for Python.


Just my 2 cents...

Best regards
Jorge
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thank you, but I am a Windows users and I don't 'do' Python etc.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 10:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
googleing is difficult without verbatim mode (the default unfortunately)
https://github.com/Jeff-Ciesielski/Boms-Away
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thanks. How does one get 'Boms-away'?
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:11 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv
format.
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.
Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away,
that is
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a
update-from-git
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away,
that is
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use
my own
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but
I get
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and
requires
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a
casual
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want,
and is
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to
projects.
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot
of the
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'John Woodgate' jmw1937@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 21:23:15 UTC
Permalink
More because I don't need. or only very rarely. Not often enough for learning to stick until the next use.

With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England

Sylvae in aeternum manent.

From: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com [mailto:kicad-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:03 PM
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches


Hi

Only because you don't want.

Python is available for windows and is widely used as a scripting language in a number of applications that are distributed with SDKs for python.
For example, the last GIS (geographical information system) I used was equipped with an full blown SDKs for both Python and VBA, but spatial transformations were available only for Python.


Just my 2 cents...

Best regards
Jorge



On 22/02/2017 12:34, 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com <mailto:***@btinternet.com> [kicad-users] wrote:

Thank you, but I am a Windows users and I don't 'do' Python etc.

With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England

Sylvae in aeternum manent.

From: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com <mailto:kicad-***@yahoogroups.com> [mailto:kicad-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 10:55 AM
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com <mailto:kicad-***@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches


googleing is difficult without verbatim mode (the default unfortunately)
but look here:

https://github.com/Jeff-Ciesielski/Boms-Away
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thanks. How does one get 'Boms-away'?
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:11 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv format.
The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.
Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'info@drukknop.nl' info@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
2017-02-23 11:33:29 UTC
Permalink
Regard it as a runtime environment like java. I never wrot a java app
but use them regular in the Arduino IDE.

no programming involved if you don't want to.

but why not go with altium? that package should be complete for the
money you pay for it...
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
More because I don't need. or only very rarely. Not often enough for
learning to stick until the next use.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:03 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hi
Only because you don't want.
Python is available for windows and is widely used as a scripting
language in a number of applications that are distributed with SDKs for
python.
For example, the last GIS (geographical information system) I used was
equipped with an full blown SDKs for both Python and VBA, but spatial
transformations were available only for Python.
Just my 2 cents...
Best regards
Jorge
Thank you, but I am a Windows users and I don't 'do' Python etc.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 10:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
googleing is difficult without verbatim mode (the default
unfortunately)
https://github.com/Jeff-Ciesielski/Boms-Away
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thanks. How does one get 'Boms-away'?
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:11 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv format.
The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.
Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
'John Woodgate' jmw1937@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-23 11:35:54 UTC
Permalink
Altium is way out of my price range.

With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England

Sylvae in aeternum manent.

From: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com [mailto:kicad-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2017 11:33 AM
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches


Regard it as a runtime environment like java. I never wrot a java app
but use them regular in the Arduino IDE.

no programming involved if you don't want to.

but why not go with altium? that package should be complete for the
money you pay for it...
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
More because I don't need. or only very rarely. Not often enough for
learning to stick until the next use.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:03 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hi
Only because you don't want.
Python is available for windows and is widely used as a scripting
language in a number of applications that are distributed with SDKs for
python.
For example, the last GIS (geographical information system) I used was
equipped with an full blown SDKs for both Python and VBA, but spatial
transformations were available only for Python.
Just my 2 cents...
Best regards
Jorge
Thank you, but I am a Windows users and I don't 'do' Python etc.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 10:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
googleing is difficult without verbatim mode (the default
unfortunately)
https://github.com/Jeff-Ciesielski/Boms-Away
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Thanks. How does one get 'Boms-away'?
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 22, 2017 9:11 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
it took a day to sort things out, but Boms-away is a system where a
python application populates the parts in your schematic with
manufaturer and number and supplier and number. It does this by reading
your schematic out of kicad (it is not necessary to have it running at
the same time) and offering you a interface to supply the info. it can
putthis info in a database as well so you can just look up data for a
combiantion footprint/value ans fill in the parts from a previous
session or project. then you generate a BOM with it as well in csv format.
The only thing missing is the visual indication if info is missing so
you can populate the fields selective in stead of having to work your
way down so not to miss anything.
Simon
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
about generating a BOM under Windows? If so, please tell me about it. I
have asked many times how to do this, with no response.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
www.jmwa.demon.co.uk <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk> <http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk>
Post by 'John Woodgate' ***@btinternet.com [kicad-users]
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> J M Woodgate and
Post by '***@drukknop.nl' ***@drukknop.nl [kicad-users]
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
*Sent:* Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Hmm. strange.
I have been using Kicad now for some years and Eagle before that. I
never trusted libraries and I make almost all parts myself, although
smisioto has some good libs as well.
I am still arguing with the developers that using GIT as the primary
libs is VERY WRONG as your own empty libs should be the default, with a
simple copying mechanism from the git repositories and a update-from-git
kind of system.
I am doing double sided and 4 layer work with it and the last thing to
iron out for me was the generation of a BOM. But with Boms-away, that is
solved now.
The few times I took a part or footprint from a site somewhere, it bit
be very hard when the first batch of pcb's had wrong sized holes or
distances. now I double check everything and as soon as I am content,
the part an footprint go in my own libs. from then on, I only use my own
libs and add components as I need them.
Strange thing is that when making a footprint, reading and translating
the datasheet drawings take way longer than drawing the footprint. even
with 128+ pads.
I am not a programmer, so I don't know what you are aiming at, but I get
my boards fabbed and burned with firmware without problems at my fab
house. I send them my BOM, gerbers, drill and pos file and a few weeks
later, there are 100 boards in my house.
I'm not sure this is called prime time or not.
just my 2 cents
Thanks to all that replied. I appreciate the input.
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires
a lot of pro grammatical work to keep it running. It's not for a casual
user who wants to do schematics.
I have found a program, McCAD that appears to do all that I want, and is
complete and much easier to use.
Again, thanks to all for helping me make my choice.
Bill
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a
medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff
works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?
2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can
things get changed without my knowledge?
3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would
tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I
can add to as required. How is it best to do that?
4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries
rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog?
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
Cheers
Doug
----------------------------------------------------------
*Sent:* Monday, February 20, 2017 3:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches
Switches are now in switches.lib. You'll need to add that lib to projects.
KiCad code releases are quite well controlled I think, but the
libraries not so much. When a KiCad release is made, a snapshot of the
latest library master branch is bundled with it. There is no "stable"
library branch, so what you get is port luck.
However, library snapshots are tagged in github with KiCad code
release, so you can get them here
https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-library/releases
I think the latest Windows installer gives you the option to install
new libraries or not. I don't know what happens on other OS.
--
*Bill Turini*
*KA4GAV*
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,
Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
--
Met vriendelijke Groet,

Simon Claessen
drukknop.nl
Dan Kemppainen dan@irtelemetrics.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-21 20:40:09 UTC
Permalink
Hi,

This is my take on the program also. Nothing against the program or
development team. I believe they have done GREAT job of getting this
going, and made great progress recently. But it's just not there, yet.

The long term road map has A LOT of my concerns covered. And I think
that in a few years it will be my program of choice. It's just going to
take some time.

Until then kick some donations/funding their way, sit back and wait a
while. It's what I'm planning on doing...

Dan
Post by Bill Turini ***@hamanuals.com [kicad-users]
From what I'm hearing, kicad is not ready for prime time. Although it
might be a very capable program, it lacks stable libraries and requires...
Andy Eskelson andyyahoo@g0poy.co.uk [kicad-users]
2017-02-21 20:54:43 UTC
Permalink
There is a long running discussion/argument regarding libs in kicad.

most people that use kicad and other CAD systems will tell you that you
should always use your own libs regardless, as that's the only way to
ensure that you always use what you know is correct.

Kicad has two lib systems which is different from other PCB design progs.

The system splits the physical part which Kicak calls the module (mod)
from the circuit drawing which kicad calls libs.

To make for some small confusion we usually refer to both when we say
libs generally :-)

Splitting the component this way means that you can have one circuit
drawing, and several different physical layouts. i.e. a resistor, and
1/8 W through hole, 1/4 w , then the SMD versions, power versions and so
on.

People used to a one to one relationship often find this annoying, but
you get used to it. You can also make kicad do a one to one if you
specify a default footprint in the circuit lib element. Of course you
will have to duplicate that part for all the variants you use.

Earlier versions of Kicad had the libs and mods both were fairly
similar in format.

A big overhaul of the library system has been going on, and a new
format was introduced for modules these are designated with
the .pretty suffix. This allows or will allow a greater degree of
control over the design. The problem is that some of the modules are
different, and there are a lot more of them. Some names have also
changed.

If you are just starting out this will make no difference, the problem
you may have seen mentioned is when you have older projects and
designs that use the older format. It's easy to convert the old to the
new. but that brings up the major problem which causes all the
annoyance.

If you download a new version of Kicad, and update the mods and libs
then you run the risk of overwriting the existing mods and libs, which
YOU may well have modified to suit your own design. Remember there is
no such thing as a "standard" companies have different requirements in
names, part number and so on. Production houses have different
requirements to match their PCB manufacturing process.

This is why you will see so many comments regarding using your own
libs and mods. All this is saying is to maintain a set of libs and
mods in your own directories, and always use them. Then if you update
Kicad or grab a update library set, then your own set remains clean,
and you don't get any nasty surprises because someone has "helpfully"
"tweaked" a component. This is one of the main problems with an open
source system, in that you don't have total control over what is in it.

At the moment the modules are fairly tightly controlled, but that's not
to say that it's perfect, as there is still the requirement that if YOU
make a local change, an update can destroy it.

Where to put your libs and mods?, anywhere you want really it one of those
things that really is up to you. Kicad does not care, you just tell it
where the libs are and it's happy.

I have a folder in my home directory (I use linux) called PCB, in that I
have a folder called my_libs (guess where I put the libs and mods?)
I have sub directories of libs. mods, and also the .pretty format
there are also a couple of special lib and mod directories that are used
for the project specific stuff - not much in them, mainly different
circuit elements for microcontrollers with the pin names changed to that
of the project function.

That works well enough for my home usage.

In windows you would typically put this in the my documents folder
somewhere.

Kicad is text based and you can tweak things that way. the kicad.pro file
is the main starting point, but to be honest it's not that necessary now.
Just use the component library manager in eschemma to set up the circuit
symbol paths and the footprint manager in pcbnew to do the same for the
footprints. You will find these in the preferences menu of each program.

Once done they will be picked up for each new project.

As you suggested, I did exactly what you want to do years ago, I Just
copied the existing kicad libs and mods as is, into my own directories
and worked on them from there.

The libs and mods are located in

usr/share/kicad/library

and

usr/share/kicad/modules

In Windows that will be

wherever you install kicad/library
wherever you install kicad/modules
just copy them to wherever you need.

Another annoyance is the use of github as a main source. this can be
difficult if there is no network. I always use local modules, so I just
delete the paths to github in the manager.

If I need a more recent module I grab it manually, check it and copy it
into my own libs.

It sounds as if you have the right idea anyway, so I don't think you
will have too many problems.

One tip for Kicad that often causes some confusion. If you don't seem to
be able to find a particular function. Check the right click context menu
as that's where what you want is lurking :-)

Andy









On Tue, 21 Feb 2017 15:51:23 +0000 (UTC)
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can things get changed without my knowledge?3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I can add to as required. How is it best to do that?4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog? 
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
CheersDoug
Doug McKnight douglasmcknight@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 00:00:05 UTC
Permalink
Andy,
Thanks very much for the reply. I'm new to KiCad, but I'm not new to using quirky EDA tools for significant projects. I like to "encapsulate" everything that a project needs so that when I return to it in 5 years time, I can easily resurrect it and make changes. It seems that my fondness for this is a straightforward tweak to the "use only your own libraries" school of thought.
So, do I need to separate into sets of three directories, one for .mod one for .lib and one for .pretty?
I actually like the separation of the schematic part of an element from it's footprint. It means I can think first about the schematic and then later worry about what parts are available easily etc etc. It works for me, so far...
The main thing I wish for, and I know I'm not the only one, is some kind of proper hierarchical layout. What I mean by that is to have "cells" or "subcircuits" on the board that are clones of each other. When one is edited, they all are. I know there are various scripts that get part way there by allowing a piece of finished layout to be replicated, and I'm about to start experimenting with one of them. It's completely intolerable to lay out the same thing 64 times... (And I doubt it would end up *exactly* the same anyway, even if I did try to do that...)
cheers,Doug

From: "Andy Eskelson ***@g0poy.co.uk [kicad-users]" <kicad-***@yahoogroups.com>
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 1:54 PM
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches

 
There is a long running discussion/argument regarding libs in kicad.

most people that use kicad and other CAD systems will tell you that you
should always use your own libs regardless, as that's the only way to
ensure that you always use what you know is correct.

Kicad has two lib systems which is different from other PCB design progs.

The system splits the physical part which Kicak calls the module (mod)
from the circuit drawing which kicad calls libs.

To make for some small confusion we usually refer to both when we say
libs generally :-)

Splitting the component this way means that you can have one circuit
drawing, and several different physical layouts. i.e. a resistor, and
1/8 W through hole, 1/4 w , then the SMD versions, power versions and so
on.

People used to a one to one relationship often find this annoying, but
you get used to it. You can also make kicad do a one to one if you
specify a default footprint in the circuit lib element. Of course you
will have to duplicate that part for all the variants you use.

Earlier versions of Kicad had the libs and mods both were fairly
similar in format.

A big overhaul of the library system has been going on, and a new
format was introduced for modules these are designated with
the .pretty suffix. This allows or will allow a greater degree of
control over the design. The problem is that some of the modules are
different, and there are a lot more of them. Some names have also
changed.

If you are just starting out this will make no difference, the problem
you may have seen mentioned is when you have older projects and
designs that use the older format. It's easy to convert the old to the
new. but that brings up the major problem which causes all the
annoyance.

If you download a new version of Kicad, and update the mods and libs
then you run the risk of overwriting the existing mods and libs, which
YOU may well have modified to suit your own design. Remember there is
no such thing as a "standard" companies have different requirements in
names, part number and so on. Production houses have different
requirements to match their PCB manufacturing process.

This is why you will see so many comments regarding using your own
libs and mods. All this is saying is to maintain a set of libs and
mods in your own directories, and always use them. Then if you update
Kicad or grab a update library set, then your own set remains clean,
and you don't get any nasty surprises because someone has "helpfully"
"tweaked" a component. This is one of the main problems with an open
source system, in that you don't have total control over what is in it.

At the moment the modules are fairly tightly controlled, but that's not
to say that it's perfect, as there is still the requirement that if YOU
make a local change, an update can destroy it.

Where to put your libs and mods?, anywhere you want really it one of those
things that really is up to you. Kicad does not care, you just tell it
where the libs are and it's happy.

I have a folder in my home directory (I use linux) called PCB, in that I
have a folder called my_libs (guess where I put the libs and mods?)
I have sub directories of libs. mods, and also the .pretty format
there are also a couple of special lib and mod directories that are used
for the project specific stuff - not much in them, mainly different
circuit elements for microcontrollers with the pin names changed to that
of the project function.

That works well enough for my home usage.

In windows you would typically put this in the my documents folder
somewhere.

Kicad is text based and you can tweak things that way. the kicad.pro file
is the main starting point, but to be honest it's not that necessary now.
Just use the component library manager in eschemma to set up the circuit
symbol paths and the footprint manager in pcbnew to do the same for the
footprints. You will find these in the preferences menu of each program.

Once done they will be picked up for each new project.

As you suggested, I did exactly what you want to do years ago, I Just
copied the existing kicad libs and mods as is, into my own directories
and worked on them from there.

The libs and mods are located in

usr/share/kicad/library

and

usr/share/kicad/modules

In Windows that will be

wherever you install kicad/library
wherever you install kicad/modules
just copy them to wherever you need.

Another annoyance is the use of github as a main source. this can be
difficult if there is no network. I always use local modules, so I just
delete the paths to github in the manager.

If I need a more recent module I grab it manually, check it and copy it
into my own libs.

It sounds as if you have the right idea anyway, so I don't think you
will have too many problems.

One tip for Kicad that often causes some confusion. If you don't seem to
be able to find a particular function. Check the right click context menu
as that's where what you want is lurking :-)

Andy

On Tue, 21 Feb 2017 15:51:23 +0000 (UTC)
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Greetings all!
I'm new to Kicad, but intending to stick with it. Half way through a medium sided project right now.
Has anyone written up an explanation of how all the library stuff works? Here's the kind of thing that I'm still trying to find out.
1. What's the story with old and new formats?2. How does Kicad use github? When does it go and get stuff. Can things get changed without my knowledge?3. What's the smart way to organize libraries on my machine? I would tend to prefer my own copy of stuff (starting with a snapshot) that I can add to as required. How is it best to do that?4. Are there text files that can be edited to point to libraries rather than doing lots of clicking in a dialog? 
If there's a Library FAQ or "Howto" I'd love to read it.
CheersDoug
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Andy Eskelson andyyahoo@g0poy.co.uk [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 14:25:40 UTC
Permalink
Doug,

You can arrange the libs in any manner you want, it really is not
critical to kicad.

Kicad uses:

.lib - for circuit elements.

.mod the old module format

.pretty the new module format

The default directories are

kicad/library (for the .libs)
kicad/modules (for the .pretty module file)

With the library managers you can add whatever directories you want to
match your own preferred workflow.

You might want to split the libs up into different types, different
process settings etc. Kicad is more than happy with that providing you
tell it where they are located.


Kicad projects do contain all the parts used, so they are pretty much
self contained, but they can be a pain to work on. but you can recover
the parts use from the projects. The schematic file has an associated
local cache file that contains the circuit elements.

The PCB file simply adds the module definitions into the file anyway.

I think the newer kicads work in the same way, but it also has the concept
of project specific libs as well. I've not used that feature.

Whenever I've archived off a project I usually create a separate lib and
mod directory for it, and make sure that everything used in them.

I've never got on with the hierarchical sheet concept, I normally just
make the circuit on one big sheet :-)

Circuit cells etc, yeah that would be nice. You can get part way there
bu saving and importing sheets, but it's a chore at best. The tric with
this is to move everything well out of the way first, as the import
always gets dropped into the centre of the page.

I think the main problem with sub circuits etc, is that kicad uses the
netlist to link things together, and it's not easy to make this
compatible with the concept of subcircuits. (and of course the associated
bits of PCB layout)

You can block copy on the schematic fairly easily, so that's not a big
issue, it's coupling that to the layout that's the painful step.

One method, which can be used is to create a dummy layout with
different component references. Save that as a separate file.

the use a simple find and replace script to change the references to
the actual refs used in the circuit. The import the dummy layout again
position and then repeat the process. To keep is simple only do this
one repeat at a time. Some people have had success using the back
annotation as well. Not something I've used very much. I tend to just
hack the files

Another option is that when you lay out a sub section, you can block copy
it, and while doing so choose only the copy the tracks rather than tracks
and components. You can then just drag and drop the actual components
from the rats nest onto the copied tracks. It helps a bit.

Andy











On Wed, 22 Feb 2017 00:00:05 +0000 (UTC)
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Andy,
Thanks very much for the reply. I'm new to KiCad, but I'm not new to using quirky EDA tools for significant projects. I like to "encapsulate" everything that a project needs so that when I return to it in 5 years time, I can easily resurrect it and make changes. It seems that my fondness for this is a straightforward tweak to the "use only your own libraries" school of thought.
So, do I need to separate into sets of three directories, one for .mod one for .lib and one for .pretty?
I actually like the separation of the schematic part of an element from it's footprint. It means I can think first about the schematic and then later worry about what parts are available easily etc etc. It works for me, so far...
The main thing I wish for, and I know I'm not the only one, is some kind of proper hierarchical layout. What I mean by that is to have "cells" or "subcircuits" on the board that are clones of each other. When one is edited, they all are. I know there are various scripts that get part way there by allowing a piece of finished layout to be replicated, and I'm about to start experimenting with one of them. It's completely intolerable to lay out the same thing 64 times... (And I doubt it would end up *exactly* the same anyway, even if I did try to do that...)
cheers,Doug
Doug McKnight douglasmcknight@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
2017-02-22 19:33:11 UTC
Permalink
Andy, Thanks for the hint about block copying tracks, and then dropping in the components. That will ease the pain somewhat.
I think the utility of hierarchical subsheets (and ideally layout) probably depends a lot on the type of stuff you do.  For what I do, I tend to quite often have repeated circuits. I find it's really nice to be able to treat them "properly" in a hierarchy.KiCad seems to handle hierarchical sheets quite well, but there are some clunky aspects to it around splitting up buses into sections. The work around I have come to prefer, is to make a hierarchical sheet that is nothing but the "connector sheet" to map the numbers appropriately.
I have a lot of experience with custom vlsi layout, and these tools are "properly" hierarchical. One may have an array of "cells" repeated many times, and when a netlist is generated the individual instances of the cell are written out into the netlist with some kind of numerical identifier added on to their name. Of course, I think the need for that kind of capability is greater for chip design.
Doug



From: "Andy Eskelson ***@g0poy.co.uk [kicad-users]" <kicad-***@yahoogroups.com>
To: kicad-***@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 7:25 AM
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] Where are relays and switches

  Doug,

You can arrange the libs in any manner you want, it really is not
critical to kicad.

Kicad uses:

.lib - for circuit elements.

.mod the old module format

.pretty the new module format

The default directories are

kicad/library (for the .libs)
kicad/modules (for the .pretty module file)

With the library managers you can add whatever directories you want to
match your own preferred workflow.

You might want to split the libs up into different types, different
process settings etc. Kicad is more than happy with that providing you
tell it where they are located.

Kicad projects do contain all the parts used, so they are pretty much
self contained, but they can be a pain to work on. but you can recover
the parts use from the projects. The schematic file has an associated
local cache file that contains the circuit elements.

The PCB file simply adds the module definitions into the file anyway.

I think the newer kicads work in the same way, but it also has the concept
of project specific libs as well. I've not used that feature.

Whenever I've archived off a project I usually create a separate lib and
mod directory for it, and make sure that everything used in them.

I've never got on with the hierarchical sheet concept, I normally just
make the circuit on one big sheet :-)

Circuit cells etc, yeah that would be nice. You can get part way there
bu saving and importing sheets, but it's a chore at best. The tric with
this is to move everything well out of the way first, as the import
always gets dropped into the centre of the page.

I think the main problem with sub circuits etc, is that kicad uses the
netlist to link things together, and it's not easy to make this
compatible with the concept of subcircuits. (and of course the associated
bits of PCB layout)

You can block copy on the schematic fairly easily, so that's not a big
issue, it's coupling that to the layout that's the painful step.

One method, which can be used is to create a dummy layout with
different component references. Save that as a separate file.

the use a simple find and replace script to change the references to
the actual refs used in the circuit. The import the dummy layout again
position and then repeat the process. To keep is simple only do this
one repeat at a time. Some people have had success using the back
annotation as well. Not something I've used very much. I tend to just
hack the files

Another option is that when you lay out a sub section, you can block copy
it, and while doing so choose only the copy the tracks rather than tracks
and components. You can then just drag and drop the actual components
from the rats nest onto the copied tracks. It helps a bit.

Andy


On Wed, 22 Feb 2017 00:00:05 +0000 (UTC)
Post by Doug McKnight ***@yahoo.com [kicad-users]
Andy,
Thanks very much for the reply. I'm new to KiCad, but I'm not new to using quirky EDA tools for significant projects. I like to "encapsulate" everything that a project needs so that when I return to it in 5 years time, I can easily resurrect it and make changes. It seems that my fondness for this is a straightforward tweak to the "use only your own libraries" school of thought.
So, do I need to separate into sets of three directories, one for .mod one for .lib and one for .pretty?
I actually like the separation of the schematic part of an element from it's footprint. It means I can think first about the schematic and then later worry about what parts are available easily etc etc. It works for me, so far...
The main thing I wish for, and I know I'm not the only one, is some kind of proper hierarchical layout. What I mean by that is to have "cells" or "subcircuits" on the board that are clones of each other. When one is edited, they all are. I know there are various scripts that get part way there by allowing a piece of finished layout to be replicated, and I'm about to start experimenting with one of them. It's completely intolerable to lay out the same thing 64 times... (And I doubt it would end up *exactly* the same anyway, even if I did try to do that...)
cheers,Doug
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